I have to say art. Comic are a visual medium. Without pictures, you no longer have a comic, but a novel or short story. Without words, you still have a comic. It's just the nature of the beast is all.

First, I agree with Hawk. A comic with good art usually is an indicator of the comic's general quality. A comic with awesome art but bad story is the minority, not the majority.

Second, there are so many webcomics these days, I really don't have to read any comics that don't have both qualities.

Third, it's kind of annoying to hear ppl say "the writing is more important than the art." I'm not trying to engender hostility, but I'd say "then go read a book." It's like being a b-ball player who's good at both dunks and 3-pointers, having to listen to someone who says 3-pointers aren't as important.

We all have opinions and the art work versus the writing is an open ended question that cannot be settled. I think that some of the 'Art trumps Writing' advocates, however, are forgetting about how many popular strips began with really bad art work, but carried a fan base strictly because the writing made them so damn appealing.

I maintain that the reverse is seldom true . . . but then that is my opinion and we know how that goes.

Of course you do not have a strip without artwork. You can, however, have a strip sans writing. That does not prove that the art work is more important than the writing, merely that there is a sub-genre wherein you CAN have a strip sans writing. If you have a 'strip' without artwork then you have a typical Terry Pratchett novel and a best seller. Hmmm . . . interesting.

I'm an advocate of great art, but I know that of the two elements, the art or the writing, that it is the writing that carries the best strips in the long run. One notes that when Charles Schultz began phoning it in with the Peanuts strip the only thing keeping the strip afloat was momentum. The art work did not change. The writing did. The strip effectively died ten to fifteen years before it was finally laid to rest.

It's been an interesting thread. Be happy. :spin:

When I attended the Joe Kubert School, we often did assignments with just graphic storytelling, silent, with no words whatsoever. The assignments were to tell a complete story, without words, allowing the comic medium to be what it fundementally is, ...pictures that tell stories. Adding great words makes it better, but in the end, the art is what makes a comic book, a comic book. Leave out the artwork, (Not sure how you would pull off a cover without art.....) solicit your "word comic" to Diamond distributors.......and see how far you get. It simply is what it is. If charles Shultz would have said........"I'm taking Peanuts in a new, bold direction. I'm getting rid of all artwork, and just having the dialogue ballons, float inside an empty panel.....ummmmmm......I'm not a rocket scientist, but common sense tells me He would, at that point, be forced to get a day job. It Just wouldn't work. John Byrne experimented with the concept of thaT VERY THING, in an issue of Alpha Flight, where a massive snow storm blotted out everything in the panel, leaving only dialogue and sound effects. It lasted 2 1/2 pages, and was interesting......Because it was short and sweet. If he would have told Marvel he wanted a whole issue like that, they would have said, no way. Marvels succsess relys on artwork to sell merchandise. No merchandise, no money. The comics don't make the money. Merchandise, movies, toys etc do.

Anything can be taken to extremes ttyler, which is were we are each going to try and prove our points. Anyway in your case, you are both a good writer and a brilliant artist, and so the entire issue does not apply where your work is concerned.

The question was not 'can you have a strip or comic without visual art' it was 'of the two elements which carries the more weight if one HAS to select one over the other' to emphasize.

I prefer a good blending of both elements naturally, but I know that the writing is ultimately a degree or two more important than the visual art whether one is talking about a gag-a-day strip or even a comic book.

Unless, of course, I am wrong. Mwahahahahaha!

Ahem! Well, that IS a possibility, I will admit.

In theory, a person's average "input" each day is 90% visual. But a good deal of what we understand, as far as abstract concepts, is through the use of stories.

I guess I'd have to say that they have to compliment each other. A gag humor comic shouldn't be drawn with the same precision as say, batman or something (a good example is probably penny arcade - its funny and well-drawn, but not over-rendered verses maybe megatokyo, which might be funny, but I can't get past the terrible art to ever go check it out); but the opposite is true as well (I've picked up quite a few free comics at conventions, and if the art doesn't please me, I'll generally skip them). However, I won't read comics in the sunday paper such as that prince whatever, but I love to read foxtrot. Though, its also interesting to see, say, a superhero comic done in a style that is different than the 'traditional' american comic (or even more 'modern' flavor of this same style).

I will generally say that I will follow a well-drawn work even with a poor story far longer than I'll ever follow one with a good plot but terrible artwork. (This may also be because I'm an artist before a writer.) But if its a style of art I don't like, even if its good, I still may drop it. This is the other problem, that "well-drawn" art is somewhat the "eye of the beholder."

In short, art is more important TO ME, but your style must DEFINITELY COMPLIMENT your writing.

I'm sorry if this point has already been brought up. I tried to read everyone's posts carefully.

You make some good points taintedsilence. I'm not actually out to win anything here anyway. It's easy to draw a line in the sand and then defend your points past the point of reason. I tend to do that all too often . . . as if any of this really matters anyway when all is said and done.

Really I just wanted to kick off some debate on a slow forum day, and that's how the top post came about. I noticed that people who are self-confessed artists before writers do put more importance in the art work in this thread and the people that are self-confessed writers before artists do put more importance in the writing.

taintedsilence
A gag humor comic shouldn't be drawn with the same precision as say, batman or something (a good example is probably penny arcade - its funny and well-drawn, but not over-rendered verses maybe megatokyo, which might be funny, but I can't get past the terrible art to ever go check it out); but the opposite is true as well (I've picked up quite a few free comics at conventions, and if the art doesn't please me, I'll generally skip them). However, I won't read comics in the sunday paper such as that prince whatever, but I love to read foxtrot.

Precisely. A year ago I was running a semi-dramatic ongoing storyline comic and so I tried to make my art work more realistic in nature. Today I am running a gag-a-day strip and struggling to 'toon' up my artwork. It's difficult for this artist to switch to cartoony art and stick with it. Particularly whenever I render humans I find myself putting in precise anatomical details which ultimately detract from the gag rather than support it. I've got a long way to go in that respect.

I consider Foxtrot nearly the ideal in the gag-a-day artwork department although I was also quite happy with the someway more realistic art found in Bloom County by Breathed.

Ideally the art work and the writing mesh together.

Bad writing, in my opinion, comes into play in gag-a-day strips when there is too much writing per panel, crowding out the artwork and bogging down, rather than supporting, the gag itself.

There are many gag-a-day strips that I cannot get into simply because the writing is too dense for my tastes. I can see the same fault in my earlier pages of the current strip. I need to do back and remove some where the character Sestus makes his appearance. I am trying to say too much.

It's a learning process.

taintedsilence
I will generally say that I will follow a well-drawn work even with a poor story far longer than I'll ever follow one with a good plot but terrible artwork.

In that I am precisely the opposite. But I do understand your points and I am in general agreement with them.

At the first glance, it's the art that really hooks a person. Getting that "hey this looks pretty rad, I'm gonna see what it's about" reaction is what it's designed to do. However, once a person is hooked in and reading, the story plays a big part too. If the story is poorly done, all you have is a bunch of really nice-looking pictures and a crappy narrative that'll send the reader heading off to greaner pastures. Likewise, if the art is really bad, not even a truly amazing story is going to be able to drag the comic back from the brink in the eyes of the average reader.

A balance is needed. Art and Writing that must work together, and work well together. Artists and Writers must take pride in their craft and in what they produce as well, since a lack of attention juts out like a sore thumb in this medium.

It can be difficult at times. But it is something that all of us are capable of.

Yes MailOrderClone. Of course striking that balance requires either natural talent or learned skills honed over time. Some of us never get things quite right.

In my case I found that for the amount of time I had available to give to a comic book I simply could not stay on schedule and maintain good enough writing and visual art standards. Something had to give and as I started missing deadlines I became dissatisfied and ultimately dropped the comic.

On the other hand, ratcheting down the writing and the art work to suit the lesser criteria of a gag-a-day strip concept seems to be working for me. In fact, keeping the word count down, while making myself stay as far away as possible from realistic looking art renderings, are the key factors now. My output has shot up and the satisfaction level has risen as well. I would have liked to have stuck to an ongoing comic book scenario, but I couldn't do it and do it right, in my estimation.

Have I got my gag-a-day strip right? I simply don't know but it feels right to me, particularly the latest pages. So I am in that 'merging writing and visual art' zone right now and I have to admit that it feels good.

Good points CharleyHorse. I guess BOTH art and writing is the best answer to this silly question. Happy Holidays.

Indeed ttyler. Peace.