Mister Mxyzptlk

imshard
But yes, you're probably right anyway. Logic, reason, even justice and fairness gave way to childishness when mass media replaced people's need to think for themselves.

Yes, the Force is strong in this one. Come, join me on the Cynical Side and we shall RULE the galaxy as Father and Son... which is only a little creepy...

(yes it is creepy) NEVER!! Cynicism is just another form of unguided petulant thought! I like to study issues on a case by case basis and form my own reasoning. I find it much preferable to making blind assumptions and relying on faulty preconceptions.

imshard
Cynicism is just another form of unguided petulant thought!

Cynicism is the only rational reaction to a world filled with greedy selfish monkeys with delusions of civilization.

Mister Mxyzptlk
Cynicism is the only rational reaction to a world filled with greedy selfish monkeys with delusions of civilization.

And that is an unreasonable view. Everybody has a redeeming value. There are very few people whose poor aspects outweigh their good ones. Those few life-sucking bastards get special notice by law enforcement and history books. It only takes a world of apathetic humans convinced that nothing can be done to relieve their misery, for us to lose everything.

You guys are missing one of the other reasons nations go to war: Population Control. There aren't enough Gen X and Gen Y to go around. You won't see American doing anything like Vietnam/Korea until at least the Echo Boom comes of age.

Question: Will the treaties that prevented America from crossing the, what was it, 38th parallel, still be in effect?

imshard
Everybody has a redeeming value.

Awww, how adorable. Hope for humanity.

Tell me, do you still leave out milk and cookies for Santa Claus?

Mister Mxyzptlk
Awww, how adorable. Hope for humanity.

Tell me, do you still leave out milk and cookies for Santa Claus?

No, I don't. And its not hope, its pragmatism. We can't stop working for a better tomorrow, or we'll have failed as sentient beings. (or at least those of us who still try to be human beings)

horseboy
You guys are missing one of the other reasons nations go to war: Population Control. There aren't enough Gen X and Gen Y to go around. You won't see American doing anything like Vietnam/Korea until at least the Echo Boom comes of age.

Question: Will the treaties that prevented America from crossing the, what was it, 38th parallel, still be in effect?

... did you miss the part where WE ARE AT WAR? *sigh* Well, ... maybe not to the degree that would result from going to war with an actual country.

And as I mentioned earlier it wasn't really a peace treaty that ended live fire combat it was a cease-fire. Officially we are still in a state of war with them. It could end any time either of the Koreas or the U.N. decide to resume combat.
Oh, sorry did everybody forget that Korea WASN'T a US war?

imshard

horseboy
You guys are missing one of the other reasons nations go to war: Population Control. There aren't enough Gen X and Gen Y to go around. You won't see American doing anything like Vietnam/Korea until at least the Echo Boom comes of age.

Question: Will the treaties that prevented America from crossing the, what was it, 38th parallel, still be in effect?

... did you miss the part where WE ARE AT WAR? *sigh* Well, ... maybe not to the degree that would result from going to war with an actual country.

And as I mentioned earlier it wasn't really a peace treaty that ended live fire combat it was a cease-fire. Officially we are still in a state of war with them. It could end any time either of the Koreas or the U.N. decide to resume combat.
Oh, sorry did everybody forget that Korea WASN'T a US war?

Always thought it was the French that started it.
But anyway, I'd like to point that in 6 years of conflict, we've lost over 3000 troops. We lost that many just taking Sweetloaf Hill during the Pacific campaign of WWII. Statistically speaking, they're safer in a DMZ than they are living in NYC. Sad on many a level.

horseboy

imshard

horseboy
You guys are missing one of the other reasons nations go to war: Population Control. There aren't enough Gen X and Gen Y to go around. You won't see American doing anything like Vietnam/Korea until at least the Echo Boom comes of age.

Question: Will the treaties that prevented America from crossing the, what was it, 38th parallel, still be in effect?

... did you miss the part where WE ARE AT WAR? *sigh* Well, ... maybe not to the degree that would result from going to war with an actual country.

And as I mentioned earlier it wasn't really a peace treaty that ended live fire combat it was a cease-fire. Officially we are still in a state of war with them. It could end any time either of the Koreas or the U.N. decide to resume combat.
Oh, sorry did everybody forget that Korea WASN'T a US war?

Always thought it was the French that started it.
But anyway, I'd like to point that in 6 years of conflict, we've lost over 3000 troops. We lost that many just taking Sweetloaf Hill during the Pacific campaign of WWII. Statistically speaking, they're safer in a DMZ than they are living in NYC. Sad on many a level.

Your assessment isn't accurate. We have better battlefield medicine tchristmas classics dvd sevenechniques which are saving more lives. We have better armor, which means that chest and torso trauma isn't as fatal, though we have more lost limbs.

The number of brain injuries in this war is staggering. They will be coming home. Funny how that ties into functionality and how we treat the non-functional in this country.

Not to mention that Iraqi dead -- which since we considered there were at best a few thousand "Al Quaeda" in Iraq. High estimates put the Iraqi dead under Saddam at a million. Even at the low end of US estimates, if we continue that same rate every year, we'll outdo Saddam's record. I hope that doesn't work out.

horseboy
Always thought it was the French that started it.
But anyway, I'd like to point that in 6 years of conflict, we've lost over 3000 troops. We lost that many just taking Sweetloaf Hill during the Pacific campaign of WWII. Statistically speaking, they're safer in a DMZ than they are living in NYC. Sad on many a level.

heh, well if the drop of a hat could start a nuclear war in NYC it'd be pretty damn safe there too. And yes casualties were higher in WWII. When you're conducting a long series of island seiges against a fortified professional veteran force of enemy troops instead of fighting an anti-guerrilla action that happens. A better comparison would be the 15-year long disaster that was the Vietnam war that caused 58,209 official KIAs.

That war had yearly US casualty counts as high as ~16,000.
The technology, tactics, and experience of the US armed forces has clearly improved.

Even that is an unfair comparison though. The situation is not the same, and neither is the enemy or its composition and tactics. The US has not truly fought this type of war before.

imshard
We can't stop working for a better tomorrow, or we'll have failed as sentient beings.

Oh come on, the majority of the monkeys on this planet are superstitious boobs who hate any other monkey for looking a little different or having a different set of superstitions. The topic of this thread is proof enough. We are discussion a war between two nations that have no reason to fight each other. The US is currently blowing up other brown people because of differences in silly superstitions. Across Africa people are killing each other over such insignificant tribal distinctions that I doubt anyone outside of those tribes could differentiate them in a lineup.

A better tomorrow? Get real, it's blind luck that's kept the apes from blowing each other into glowing dust this long. They can't keep being lucky much longer. Why bother with maintaining delusions about the decency of humanity? They just don't have any.

mapaghimagsik
High estimates put the Iraqi dead under Saddam at a million. Even at the low end of US estimates, if we continue that same rate every year, we'll outdo Saddam's record.

I'm sure with a combination of good old American know how and Yankee ingenuity they'll be able to beat old Saddam's record! After all, he was just an a-rab them American boys is white folks who are REAL good at blowin' up the brown folks. Look at how good the Brits did in that region seventy years ago! I'll bet Bush can do at least as good as Churchill did!

Come on folks, lets cheer them on!

horseboy
You guys are missing one of the other reasons nations go to war: Population Control. There aren't enough Gen X and Gen Y to go around. You won't see American doing anything like Vietnam/Korea until at least the Echo Boom comes of age.

Don't let that problem worry you one little bit. The lab coats are coming up with a solution!

With this...

http://video.aol.com/video/exoskeletons-transform-us-military/2029746

Even the 60 year old retired military types can be reactivated and sent to the front lines!

Woohoo! Eternal war!

If your only examples are America and Africa, yeah, you're going to be a bitter cynic. Have fun with that.

TnTComic
If your only examples are America and Africa, yeah, you're going to be a bitter cynic. Have fun with that.

What, you want reasons to be cynical from Europe? They only gave up beating the crap out of each other every twenty years seventy some years ago and that was because the Cold War kept their sphincters real tight since they would be the battle ground if the US and Soviets decided to rumble. It took the ability to destroy the earth several times over to keep those monkeys from rumbling.

Want a reason to be cynical about from more places? China and India are coming online to burn more oil each year than the US does in ten years. They don't worry about the Tree Huggers, they just lock the stinky hippies up when they get uppity.

There's plenty of horrible crap going on in the world to be cynical about and damn little to give hope over.

TnTComic

Close to two thousand years of history where the European tribes beat the crap out of each other every twenty years for no good reason and they skip around 4 cycles and you've got your hope up? I'll bet twenty years after the last US troop leaves Europe they'll be back to bitch slapping each other over imagined slights again.

Yes, 70 years of peace is something positive. Being a cynic, you'll find any way possible to diminish it. Europe, Canada... there's plenty of places to be positive about. But you'll never look at it that way.

TnTComic
Europe, Canada... there's plenty of places to be positive about.

Yes, lovely Europe. England, where every step you take is videotaped for future viewing by governmental voyeurs. Germany, where thought crime is all the rage. France, where the bar of soap is like garlic to the vampire. Eastern Europe... Nuff said.

Canada? Yeah, the hope for the future rests with a bunch of people who can't tell the difference between ham and bacon.

By all means, keep holding that hope for humanity high. It makes it so much more hilarious when those hopes come crashing to hard pavement of reality.

You forgot the blatant racism and immigrant destroyed economies when you were referring to Europe and especially France.

The lack of good things in the world is the reason we need to rise up against our stations in the world and make changes for ourselves instead of waiting on the politicians who profit from keeping things the same.

imshard
You forgot the blatant racism and immigrant destroyed economies when you were referring to Europe and especially France.

Well thanks a lot. I was saving that for later. Playing the racism card always demoralizes the hopeful.

imshard
The lack of good things in the world is the reason we need to rise up against our stations in the world and make changes for ourselves instead of waiting on the politicians who profit from keeping things the same.

Yeah, you do that. Have fun wasting time and energy beating your head against that brick wall. Just try hard to save some time for your family so they don't forget who you are while you're off righting the wrongs of the world. If you're not careful you'll turn around one day and see your kids have grown up and don't know who you are.

Mister Mxyzptlk

imshard
You forgot the blatant racism and immigrant destroyed economies when you were referring to Europe and especially France.

Well thanks a lot. I was saving that for later. Playing the racism card always demoralizes the hopeful.

imshard
The lack of good things in the world is the reason we need to rise up against our stations in the world and make changes for ourselves instead of waiting on the politicians who profit from keeping things the same.

Yeah, you do that. Have fun wasting time and energy beating your head against that brick wall. Just try hard to save some time for your family so they don't forget who you are while you're off righting the wrongs of the world. If you're not careful you'll turn around one day and see your kids have grown up and don't know who you are.

I wish I knew what the hell you're talking about.
My point is nothing was ever accomplished by people sitting around bitching about shit instead of doing something about it. I'm an activist in an number of fields but I still go home every night.

Mister Mxyzptlk
Canada? Yeah, the hope for the future rests with a bunch of people who can't tell the difference between ham and bacon.

That's the best you've got?

I don't know what's sadder, your views, or that you think its something we've never heard before. Trudge on, angry man, the world will always suck as much as you think.

Mister Mxyzptlk
There's plenty of horrible crap going on in the world to be cynical about and damn little to give hope over.

Brother-Librarian Turgis
Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.

Sorry, I've been playing a lot of Dawn of War lately.