I seriously think DC and Marvel were just BSing when they made these clowns. I always hear so much buzz and support for them. But why? They dont do anything!
Ironman, Marvel's weak responce to Batman. A billionaire socilite who can't help it but to get in on the crime-fighting scene. SEEN IT! The onlything different is they give him an iron suit. OOO-OOO, spooky. So is he suppose to be a cyborg, a man in a cyborg suit, what!? Tony Stark is the ripoff of Bruce Wayne, and yet Iron Man is the rip off of Mr. Freeze. Think about it!

And another useless "hero" comes from the DC Universe. The Green Lantern, and all of his personas. There is like 5 Lanterns, WHY!? And the only wany to be one is to have the ring. And you can guess where I'm going- straight from Captain Planet's Planeteers. I seen the trailers for the new animated movie, powered by Wind. What were the others, Earth and Fire?! And each one is given the ring by "the Guardians of the Universe". I dunno who made Captain Planet but I sure hope they get a fat check for everytime The Lantern gets a fan. And they both have bogus weaknesses, Capt. Planet's being pollution, and Green Lantern being yellow. YELLOW IS HIS WEAKNESS! A color cannot be a man's weakness. It makes no damn scense!

That's all I have for right now. I was gonna start on Aquman... but I don't want people to think I'm a spiteful dick. So that's my vented rant on two useless heros. Anyone agree, care to dispute? I'd like to read someone to actually defend any of the three I mentioned.
Thanks for reading eitherway.

All those comic characters are pretty old. I don't think the Mr Freeze character was much of a big thing when Iron Man came out.
And the Green Lantern is much older than Captain Planet. His fear of yellow probably had to do with the limited colours that comics had back then. They could make the idea of introducing yellow into the issue as a much bigger, more interesting thing than it would be otherwise.

Plus, comics then worked on very simple symbolism. Just the fact that his name has a colour in it is an important story theme. That's how basic that stuff was.
Aquaman is just as simple. He's an underwater Tarzan mixed with Posiden.

We all know that modern hero comics are about emo musclemen and some women fighting each other and being emo about themselves, but in the old days it was all about simple action stories and what they did rather than what they were: which was the exact same basic model, just in different costumes and having a slightly different theme, based on their crazy name and costume.

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I'm not disparaging hero comics here. Just being flippant.

First of all, Green Lantern came out in 1940 and Captain Planet in 1990, 50 YEARS LATER!!!

If you want to put it that way, then is Ted Turner who should be paying DC for everytime that eco-dork got a fan...

Second, the Lanterns powers need the will power and courage of the user to work. The Green Ring is used as some sort of amplifier that materialize the imagination of the user. A man without fear (like Hal Jordan) or with enough imagination (like Kyle Rayner) could basically materialize anything from the ring and increase his powers without limits.

Third, all the Yellow weakness is result of 50 years of storytelling and retconning. Basically, the chromatic manifestation of the will power and courage (the elements that the Green Lantern's ring needs to work) is green, and his polar opposite (fear) is represented by the color yellow and it the result of the creature called Parallax (physical manifestation of fear) being trapped inside of the Power Batery of Oa (Homeplanet of the Guardians), when Parallax escaped and infected Hal Jordan (First Earth's Lantern) during the Death Of Superman and the Emerald Twilight storylines, the Yellow Weekness disapeared. However, there are now Yellow Rings (used by the Sinestro Corps) that work using fear intead of courage as its main fuel.

Of course, you have to consider that the Yellow Weakness was created during the Silver Age...

Fourth, there are many Lanterns because the Guardians select one creature from every sector in the Galaxy to form a Space Police Corps. There is not only 1 Lantern, but many.

Cronologicaly speaking, Hal Jordan was the first Lantern from Earth, then Guy Gardner was selected as a replacement, so as John Stewart. When Jordan became Parallax and killed the other Lanterns (with the exceptions of Gardner and Stewart, not active members at that time), Kyle Rayner was given the last Ring and became the Last Green Lantern.

As for Ironman, his motivations are waaaaaay different than Batman's. Batman's main drive is vengeance and justice, keep anybody from suffer the losts that he suffered, while Ironman just wants to keep his corporation at safe.

With Barman, you have the idea that the spoiled playboy (Bruce Wayne) is just a mask to hide Batman, while Stark is a jerk with or without the armor.

Alright, glad some people explained. I honestly didnt know that Planet was before Latern... I should def. do my homework before I go on a rant.
But thanks for reading anyways. I feel lot better with my hate of Aquman/G.L/Ironman off my chest, lol.
But still, how you explain Iron Man as not a Batman rip off!?

Dark Pascual
Of course, you have to consider that the Yellow Weakness was created during the Silver Age...

I seem to remember that the weakness of the Golden Age Green Lantern was wood. No more logical than yellow, but there you go. It's always one damn thing or another!

I like ironman, well actually the new ironman comics that spurred after the movie came out. He's one of the more well written characters (or rather, one that hasn't been beaten to death by the moronic spin-offs and retcons, but he's well on his way) he's kind of a comic nerds subtle pipe dream while still having serious enough flaws to not make him a gary stu.
He's also far from useless, in many comics taking up the role as 'leader' or head for the superheroes as he can supply them with support, equipment, lodging, and intel. If you think he's a true batman rip-off then i'm guessing you've never read a comic with him in it :$

I'm not a fan of green lantern/don't follow his story(s) so i dunno lol

New Age Hemingway
But still, how you explain Iron Man as not a Batman rip off!?

Because their origins, motivations and M.O are totally different. Besides that they where created and inspired by historical and social circumstances totally different.

Batman's main motivation was the death of his parents and the desire of vengeance and that nobody has to face the same lost again. To do that he relies on the fear to take psycological advantage of his enemies, and in his detective skills.

Ironman just wants to keep his businnes safe, and relies more on his technological advantages and in raw firepower.

And as I told before, Bruce Wayne is just the mask to hide Batman, while Tony Stark is himself with or without the armor.

New Age Hemingway
But still, how you explain Iron Man as not a Batman rip off!?

I don't know, he probably is in a way.
But as I said: Back when those comics were created, what they were wasn't important. It was what they did.

The whole Ironman concept is based on his name and outfit, not him being some rich guy, that came second to the name. Same with batman. So from that perspective, they're totally different:
One is a musclely guy in a metal suit that beats up bad guys and one is a muscley guy in a bat suit that beats up bad guys. See; different! lol!

The stories rip each other off because they're pretty limited themes and there's not too much you can do with them, is there? They're all going to be the same in some ways...
-All these homo-erotic Nietzschian gods dealing with the dichotomy of their supremacy Vs their ordinary human inadequacies, that do nothing but reflect their writer's own lack of imagination in trying to think of their all too human selves in the forms of these new-born comic-based godlings... (still flippant, not derogatory... because that's party bulsh*t)

Very good disputes. Makes perfect sense. Lol, never knew I'd get schooled so hard it make me humble.
But one more I wanna know before I go to bed. What about The Flash? Can anyone say anything good about a dude that just runs.

I have no idea. His theme is speed I suppose; being very fast. All those old comics started with a gimmick.

The thing is that when comics became a little bit more "serious" (the Bronze Age and the Dark-Dork Age) many of the powers of those super heroes where retconed and revisioned.

Now, have in mind that, as well as with Green Lantern, there has been several heroes that used the name of Flash.

In the case of Flash, he cannot only run fast, but also HITS fast and do a lot of things related to acceleration and speed (create tornados, vibrate through matter and acelarate on molecular levels, for example). At least that was the case with Barry and Bart Allen...I don't think that either Jay Garrick or Wally West had the same speed power level.

Then, during the Crisis on Infinite Earths, it was introduced the concept of the Speed Force, some sort of extra dimensional energy that basically is the drive of all speedsters on DC Universe.

Among other things, the Speed Force allows to undo the effects of the Anti-Live Equation (some sort of energy that allows to control the reality) and run faster than light, and even allows some sort of time traveling.

New Age Hemingway
What about The Flash? Can anyone say anything good about a dude that just runs.

Me! I like the Flash!

I find there are two types of super hero fan: those who like their heroes to be all-powerful with dozens of different super powers because then they can just do so much; and those who prefer their super heroes to have limited (or even no) super powers so that they have to rely on their wits more and be more inventive with what they've got. The first group tend to like Superman because he can, like, move whole mountains and stuff. I'm more in the second group. Batman and Flash etc are more interesting to me because they can't just move mountains and solve world hunger by re-siting a few lakes. They have to be more creative.

So, to me, Flash is interesting precisely because he only has one power. His writers have to be doubly inventive in thinking up new ways to use his super speed: running (obviously), creating whirlwinds, creating cushions of air, vibrating himself through obstacles, climbing buildings, crossing water etc etc.

Like Green Lantern, I think he does suffer from the fact that there have been so many different people bearing the Flash name but - in another way - this just makes him like Doctor Who. Everyone has their own favourite Doctor and every Flash fan has his own favourite Flash!

Certainly, the motion pictures have found way to keep Iron Man relevant for this millenium given all the warfare happening in the world. Never mind the environmental messages soon to be placed in the films. I'm sure the same will be done for Ryan Reyno...I mean...Dead Po...WAIT...I mean Green Lantern.

Also appreciated is the journey Tony Stark has been in with substance abuse. Its always great to humanize these heroes.

I don't like how the American cartoons in its latest projection have turned Stark into a teenager (roughly) as if he's the compliment of Batman: Year One. They've done the same with The X-Men...as if they need to appeal to the tween set.

What's most interesting to me is that this genre and many of these characters began as general but simple entertainment to appeal to kids of "tween" ages... (and everyone else as well, but the tweens were the lowest level and a good target I suppose. Maybe young teens too?)... but that (mainly) young audience didn't keep renewing, instead it mostly grew up, and so did the comics; so something that started out very obviously made to be simple has had to morph into something a lot more complicated.

But while these superhero comics really are intelligently written, really cleverly produced and wonderfully illustrated, they still have their mass entrainment tweeny origins at their core s in the form of the super heroes themselves.
Which is a bit of an albatross in some ways...

You have people in those movies trying to reinvent the idea to be more serious, laughing at the idea of "yellow Spandex" etc... but the problem with that is they're STILL the same musclemen superheros with the descriptive names. So it doesn't matter whether they were bright spandex or not, they'll always be wearing it on the inside. :)
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My thoughts are that, while the genre has grown up, it has a tenuous existence that balances on sort of an edge all the time.- On one had it's an outgrowth and an extended lifespan for those 30's and 40's hero characters, on another it's a cartoonised version of the ever popular Hollywood action hero archetypes (rambo etc), on still another it's living literature and exciting, interesting visual art, and on yet another it's a tired old franchise for a few tried old publishing companies that are long past their prime.

*puts nerd fanboy glasses on*

New Age Hemingway
I seriously think DC and Marvel were just BSing when they made these clowns. I always hear so much buzz and support for them. But why? They dont do anything!

uhm, probably because these characters have a history full of badass moments and great sories? but then again, THATS JUST ME

Ironman, Marvel's weak responce to Batman. A billionaire socilite who can't help it but to get in on the crime-fighting scene. SEEN IT! The onlything different is they give him an iron suit. OOO-OOO, spooky. So is he suppose to be a cyborg, a man in a cyborg suit, what!? Tony Stark is the ripoff of Bruce Wayne, and yet Iron Man is the rip off of Mr. Freeze. Think about it!

wow, where the hell are you getting this from? you obviously dont know what youre talking about. Iron Man is hardly "Marvel's Bruce Wayne". Hes an alcoholic. Hes far more technology based than Batman. His parents werent murdered. He doesnt make young boys dress in skimpy clothes. he doesnt drive a car.

do i REALLY need to explain how iron man isnt a rip off of mr freeze? or is iron man just a rip off of any armor based superhero or villain to you?

And another useless "hero" comes from the DC Universe. The Green Lantern, and all of his personas. There is like 5 Lanterns, WHY!? And the only wany to be one is to have the ring. And you can guess where I'm going- straight from Captain Planet's Planeteers. I seen the trailers for the new animated movie, powered by Wind. What were the others, Earth and Fire?! And each one is given the ring by "the Guardians of the Universe". I dunno who made Captain Planet but I sure hope they get a fat check for everytime The Lantern gets a fan. And they both have bogus weaknesses, Capt. Planet's being pollution, and Green Lantern being yellow. YELLOW IS HIS WEAKNESS! A color cannot be a man's weakness. It makes no damn scense!

neither does a grown man deciding he wants to fight crime and being able to beat up an alien. neither does people jumping in the air and staying there. neither does being able to bend stell in your bare hands like paper.

That's all I have for right now. I was gonna start on Aquman... but I don't want people to think I'm a spiteful dick.

too late

So that's my vented rant on two useless heros. Anyone agree, care to dispute? I'd like to read someone to actually defend any of the three I mentioned.
Thanks for reading eitherway.

are you serious? you sound like an angry 13 year old who loves the dark knight and looked at a picture of iron man and green lantern in wizard magazine and went "oh these guys are lame" you clearly show no knowledge of the history or origins behind these characters and the artists who created them and added to their legacy. this thread is a waste of time.

Well, I do think that Iron Man is culled from the Batman model. And, well, he's hardly the only Marvel vigilante to take a few pages from the Bat handbook. We also have Daredevil, Moon Knight, The Shroud, Nighthawk, and more than a few others.

Batman is hardly an original character either. The only reason he exists is because National wanted a character in Detective Comics who was similar to the wildly successful Superman.

And, naturally, Batman owes a lot to characters like Zorro, The Shadow, The Spider, Robin Hood, Dick Tracy, Sherlock Holmes, and The Scarlet Pimpernel. There was even a pulp character in the 30's called The Black Bat. He was a guy who dressed up in a bat suit and fought crime. He came up with the gimmick when a bat flew in through his window.

Nothing is original. Everything has been done. The best you can hope for as an artist is an interesting variation.

I've never been fond of Superman.

Ironman's pretty cool though, and the Ironman film was the best superhero film of last year (The Dark Knight can suck my balls).

This is my Top 10 heroes (Marvel/DC):

1.- Batman
2.- Green Lantern (Hal Jordan/Kyle Rayner)
3.- Superman
4.- Captain America
5.- Iron Man
6.- Flash (Barry Allen)
7.- Spiderman
8.- Blue Beetle (Jaime Reyes)
9.- Moon Knight
10.- Nightwing

I don't see how anyone could think that Iron Man is a Batman knockoff. Let's look at their similarities logically.

1. Both super rich.
2. Both own corporations.
3. Both fight crime.
4. Both... er, are human males.

That's pretty much it. Beyond that, they're about as similar as oil and vinegar. Iron Man solves his problems through the use of superior firepower. Batman uses his noggin to out-think his opponents. You are right about one thing though, Air Raid. Nothing is original.

Stan Lee himself explained somewhere that his motivation for creating the Iron Man character was that he wanted to do a superhero that was like millionaire-industrialist-playboy Howard Hughes, someone who certainly has the money and infrastructure to be a superhero but is not naturally inclined to heroics per se. So, it is not like Batman, who pretends to be a carefree rich boy but really is this super serious, tormented guy. Tony Stark actually IS a carefree, rich playboy. The Iron man suit is nothing but his way to get the ultimate thrills, because he has an addictive personality: when the suit is not enough to satisfy him, he turns to women, when women are not enough, he turns to booze...
To me that doesn't sound anything like Bruce "Mr. Healthy lifestyle" Wayne.

Now that you mention it, he does remind me of Howard Hughes. He even looks similar (with that mustache), and uses his money to explore new areas of science that others are afraid to venture into due to the low possibility of high profits.

How can anyone not like Iron Man after watching the great movie?

And the thing is, that movie Iron Man is Iron Man. The writers did not have to rewrite the comic book Iron Man to make him more "believeable" or "three dimensional" etc etc. Iron Man is a great character who is not the standard hero archetype; he's very broad in potential.

I really loved the movie mlai, I also like Iron Man. I'm fond of the heroes that have human flaws and weaknesses.

Doctor Shadow
I really loved the movie mlai, I also like Iron Man. I'm fond of the heroes that have human flaws and weaknesses.

Ditto. That's why I like Tony Stark.

And that is REALLY why I have always liked Hal Jordan.

Hal is a flawed human being. He acts impulsively at times, and his impulsive behavior has led to death and pain that he has lived with for years. Heck, when a portion of California bought the big one during the Death and Return of Superman Hal decided to kill and/or maim every Green Lantern to take their rings! Why? So he could rebuild California and resurrect the dead. He wasn't thinking objectively at the time, but would you if darn near everyone you loved perished and your buddies in the Green Lantern Corps refused to help you bring them back? He eventually saw the error of his ways and killed himself to save the planet Earth but that's arguably what any of us would have done in his situation. When DC brought him back a few years ago (taken from a time and era where he never did the heinous acts that darn near destroyed Earth), he felt like crap about the whole thing and questioned how stable of a person he actually was and if he deserved to wield a ring. THAT is a human being making real decisions.

Hal Jordan comes off as a flawed human. All of the human Green Lanterns do, for that matter. It's the perfect example of "with great power comes great responsibility" if you ask me.

Yeah, Hal Jordan is one of my favourite versions of the Green Lantern, just because he has those flaws and reactions.

Have to admit that while Hal Jordan is one of my favorite characters (and I marked out big time when he resurected in Green Lantern Rebirth), I like Kyle Rayner a little bit better.

He was not chosed to be GL because he was a man with no fear, but because there was nobody else, and that made some interesting situations, since Rayner struggled to be a hero and a worthy carrier of the GL legacy.

Green Latern's movie looks pretty sweet to me...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hTiRnqnvDs

That is one heck of an awesome fake trailer...

Dr Shadow....what do you mean fake??
I believe Captain Mal from Firefly will be cast as Green lantern!
Don't insult my religion!!!!!

Heh. It was quite apparent that our friend Hemingway had never opened a Green Lantern book in his life, seeing as he apparently thought there was a Wind green lantern, Fire Green lantern, Heart Green lantern and so on.

I guess they could summon the Jolly Green Giant, eh?

If you want to get a really nice introduction to the Green Lantern Universe, I suggest looking up the cartoon called Green Lantern: First Flight.

Trust me. You'll like it.