this is interesting...
I remember reading that a lot of the serial killers were porn addicts and that over addcition to porn correleate to higher sex crimes, but i found a couple of studies that refute that belief.

it seems that a more sexual freeing society can decrease the incidence of sex crimes. So maybe the suppression of sexual urges are causing more problems for the society than the expression of it.

Someone
The incidence of rape in the United States has declined 85% in the past 25 years while access to pornography has become freely available to teenagers and adults. The Nixon and Reagan Commissions tried to show that exposure to pornographic materials produced social violence. The reverse may be true: that pornography has reduced social violence.

According to his number crunching, between 1980 and 2004 the four states with the lowest internet access rates had a 53% increase in rape, while the four states with the highest internet access experienced a 27% decrease.

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=913013



http://anthonydamato.law.northwestern.edu/Adobefiles/porn.pdf [anthonydamato.law.northwestern.edu]

Someone
A lower per capita crime rate and historically high availability of pornography in many developed European countries (e.g. Netherlands, Sweden) has led a growing majority to conclude that there is an inverse relationship between the two, such that an increased availability of pornography in a society equates to a decrease in sexual crime. Moreover, there is some evidence that states within the U.S. that have lower rates of internet access have a greater incidence of rape

www.standfordstudy.com [law.stanford.edu]

Someone
Presently in Japan, sexually explicit video tapes, books, and magazines which cater to all sorts of erotic interests and fetishes are readily available. These include sexually obvious manga without age restrictions as to availability. Phone booths in commercial areas and city newspapers contain advertisements for sexual liaisons of every sort. However, this availability of modern pornography is relatively new.

In Japan, rapes decreased 79 percent while public indecency decreased 33 percent. The reason for the difference is not clear. We believe the compulsivity generally associated with the crimes considered under the public indecency law are less easily modified than is rape.

Japan has the lowest number of reported rape cases and the highest percentage of arrests and convictions in reported cases of any developed nation. Indeed Japan is known as one of the safest developed countries for women in the world (Clifford, 1980)

Wilson (1978, pp. 175) found that "Males who develop deviant patterns of sexual behavior in adulthood have suffered relative deprivation of experience with pornography in adolescence." He suggests that pornography not only can, but does, help to prevent criminal sex problems (pp. 176). Wilson claims exposure to sexually explicit materials can have therapeutic advantages and, among couples, help by promoting greater communication and openness to discuss sexual matters, and provide sex education. It can also help by providing an anxiety and inhibition-relieving function. Thirty-nine percent of the convicts surveyed by Walker (1970) agreed that pornography "provides a safety valve for antisocial impulses."

http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/online_artcls/pornography/prngrphy_rape_jp.html [hawaii.edu]

that's a good arguement Sub ! just as i always suspected. it woul be interesting to see the numbers for those societies that are tottaly repressive and anti-porn. i remember reading somewhere that it was illegal to masturbate in Indoneasia(i'm pretty sure that was the country) and anyway , they had a high level of rape and stuff. i should realy back that up with something.

Yeah, I've always suspected this to be the case.

However, they do have a point on that whole addiction bit. Normally viewing porn and having an addiction to it are two very different things.

while watching porn once or twice on an regular basis won't turn you into an raging criminal or an addicted fiend like what certain people would like you to believe, you have to be careful that it doesn't like take over your life.

some people have what we could call an "Addictive personality"...they would get addicted to anything... porn, achchol, etc from the first time they try it. they don't realize that like collecting over 3,500 videos/tapes is going overboard and clearly shows that they might have an problem.

After all, most people who has porn usually only has like maybe 3 to 10 tapes, but nothing more. heck, even just one porn tape would be enough for some people because on some tapes out there, they have different scenery and different porn stars "acting" out different scenarios in short stories all on one tape.

Porn can be an great outlet... but one of the main concerns with it is that a lot of the porn often has those unrealistic things going on in it.

For example: in a lot of "real-life" porn, there's those women who "squirts" when they supposedly have an orgasm.
In real life, women don't squirt..they just get moist. But a lot of men out there are actually led to believe that women can squirt their stuff during an orgasm. Why? Because some porn actress put water into her lower bits and held it during the scene until it was time to release it during her faked orgasm.
in porn, they tend to exaggerate a lot of things like that.

So any young man who's watched porn from that before they have sex for the first time, might end up having those unrealistic expectations of women and end up disappointed.
So no woman expect maybe an porn star would be good enough for those men, and they may not end up having any stable relationships, ever.

I've heard of things like that happening. I think this is one of reasons why so many people are so against porn at times... not only because it's "Deviant", but because of the impressions it leaves on young people about women and men out there.

Anyway this was just my argument against this for the heck of it. I'm not really against porn, but just offering my thoughts. =D

I don't have a problem with it per se. But, anything in excess is unhealthy.

Plus, depending on the person it could actually be harmful. The objectification of the person is a dangerous thing, because in a weaker mind it may start relating the subject as "less" than themselves and relate the experience to real life. "Will you respect me in the morning?" is about objectification, too. There are plenty of people out there that think that this person or that person is just a piece of tail. That ain't right either.

Why? Because the person doing the objectifying may start to think that other people are "less than human". What's worse, the person that is BEING objectified my actually start perceiving themselves that way. You can laugh at the hooker, or just use them for sex, but did you ever wonder how she got that way? You probably wouldn't have fared any better either...

Same can be said for violence, too. These violent video games that are out now could actually really do a number on an unstable person. They can start to think that shooting people is fun. I'm simplifying the process, but I think you get the idea, right? This is aslo a way of objectifying a person.

Now think about the future. Full immersion VR for sex or violent games. I fear some people would not be able to understand the disconnect.

It's just always good to keep those things in check.

Now, that said, the USA is probably on of the prudest nations in the world when it comes to sex. All that pent up hostility about the most natural of instincts is probably producing the most depraved deviants yet... tsk, tsk.

These include sexually obvious manga without age restrictions as to availability.

I think some of the info you're quoting may be dated, at least as far as Japan is concerned. They do have age restrictions on media, including manga, in Japan. In fact, censorship has become pretty strict since the early 90's. Parent groups have become more active in trying to restrict what materials their kids can get their hands on. While the biggest target is usually violence, sexual content has gotten a bit of attention, too. Nudity on broadcast TV is a thing of the past in Japan, and even manga often comes with warning labels if the content is too adult.

Indeed Japan is known as one of the safest developed countries for women in the world (Clifford, 1980)

I find it hard to believe ANYONE honestly believes that. Things have gotten better in recent years, but what other country has to segregate the sexes on trains to avoid molestation? Where else do you find signs on public streets to watch out for and report possible sexual deviants? Just because less women are willing to report these incidents, that doesn't make the country safer for them. I've had friends who went over there to study abroad and they had some pretty awful horror stories to tell.

After all, most people who has porn usually only has like maybe 3 to 10 tapes, but nothing more.

I'd be willing to bet that isn't true. The internet makes finding porn incredibly easy. I'd be willing to bet that most people who are interested in porn and who use the internet to get their fix have pretty hefty collections on their hard drives. If it were still the 80's and people still had to pay for porn, I'd probably agree with you, but seeing as anyone can hit up a torrent site or google whatever material they're looking for for free these days, I'd find it hard to believe that people would limit themselves to only a handful. This doesn't mean people are more obsessive, just that normal people are just as capable of having larger collections these days.

Overall, I agree with the premise behind this that adult media doesn't necessarily have a negative effect on society. In many cases it can serve as an outlet for the sexually frustrated or deprived. I don't think it has a great an influence as people are saying though. I also find the Japan is a horrible example of any country that could be considered "safe" for women. While adult entertainment is commonplace, the society itself is still extremely repressed. Plus, while advances are being made, their society is still predominantly male-oriented. Women are frequently objectified outside of the media. In the workplace, on the streets, in trains, schools, etc. There is pretty rampant abuse because many men know they can get away with it and that being the victim is often more shameful than being the offender.

Heh what guy hasn't watched tons of porn by the age of 20? But besides that obvious fact:

Its been said by many sex experts its better for when you go to do the act itself.
unless its snuff porn...*shudder*

I wouldn't go as so far as to call pornography "good" for anything (other than gettin' one's rocks off.) But, I don't think it's quite as evil as "some" would have the populace believe. I don't think it can be "blamed" for avarice in mongers; (people must take a modicum of responsibility.)

isukun
I think some of the info you're quoting may be dated, at least as far as Japan is concerned.

I believe those studies were for the Nixon and Reagan Commissions when they were trying to censor porn because they believed it increased rape. but the validity of the statistics is still there.

but the other data are current, especially the one about internet porn.

i read that when america took over japan, they started to censor a lot of what they thought was overtly sexual. when they left the japanese started to do the same thing.

Japanese in the past didn't really think there was anything wrong with Fertility festivals or having a temple full of stone penises until westerners came in and told them it was wrong.

You know, the minute I saw this title I was going to jokingly say "It prevents rape," but apparently it's true. I'm psychic.

It's questionable weather there is any link between sexual violence and porn- either in a good or bad way.
Many people have tried to prove a relationship, both negative and positive, but it's always fuzzy... Like video games and violence, the internet and violent sexual behaviour, or violent TV shows and violent crime. In the end it seems that various entertainment media has NO significant influence on people's actions or ways of thinking. What truly seems to affect them is their upbringing, environment, social situation, education etc: the real influences in their lives. Entertainment media seems at best to be a purely peripheral factor, and a convenient scapegoat for certain sectors in society.

subcultured
i read that when america took over japan, they started to censor a lot of what they thought was overtly sexual. when they left the japanese started to do the same thing.

it was before that, during the Meji time in an effort to look cool in front of the christians. and some of those stupid laws are still on the books , that's why a lot of hentai ladies don't have any bush, and also the origen of those lovely mosaics.


btw - Japan was actually the first country in history to have porn rental shops! 200 years ago !

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_porn#History [en.wikipedia.org] FASCINATING!!!

I don't have any research, but personal experience tells me a lot. I've been around porn addicts. I used to work with one when I was lifeguarding, and he was the absolute worst person to be around. He kept saying awful, sexist things about women and it really bothered me. However, I'm sure I've been around other porn addicts and I didn't even know they had the problem. I'm just going to have to agree with Spang and say that too much of anything is unhealthy.

I believe pornography probably does harm marriages. Most men's wives can't compete with the digitally and surgically altered women of the internet.

On Japan
Whatever your thoughts on porn, viewing it at as child is probably not the best context for it. One of Japan's big problems is the availability of porn. You usually don't have to travel much further than a block to find a vending machine full of it. And even if you're not looking for it, you'll find it in your mailbox every morning in the form of flyers and advertisements. So, what keeps children for getting their hands on it? Pretty much nothing. Heck, even the newspapers feature a few pornographic shots in them.

I agree with Isukun. Women aren't treated very well in Japan. They're groped on the trains, they're beaten by their husbands more commonly than in America, and they're more strictly confined to certain jobs and roles. Now, is pornography related to that? I can't shake the idea that a medium in which women are commonly objectified certainly wouldn't help.

By the way, Japan may report a low amount of rape and abuse cases, but the country has a high amount of unreported cases.

I don't have any research, but personal experience tells me a lot. I've been around porn addicts. I used to work with one when I was lifeguarding, and he was the absolute worst person to be around.

I've been around a few addicts, myself and I find their attitudes toward women are highly based on their pre-existing personalities and not what's on their harddrives. A lot of people are able to disconnect the fantasy from the reality.

Most men's wives can't compete with the digitally and surgically altered women of the internet.

I'd say the physical presence of the wife is a pretty big point in their favor. There are some things you just can't get through masturbation.

Whatever your thoughts on porn, viewing it at as child is probably not the best context for it.

The link between media influences and children's behavior is highly contextual. Kids associate what they see with how it is presented. A behavior that is rewarded or shown in a positive light is far more influential than a behavior that is punished or viewed negatively.

Personally, I think Japan's problems are more deeply rooted than simply looking at porn. There are many aspects of their culture which favor a male-dominated society from simple entertainment, to popular religions. The whole way they view gender roles is flawed from a western perspective. While they have made great advances over the past twenty years, they are still playing catch-up. These changes don't occur overnight.

Porn.

No drama. No bull. Save the $$$.

And shake your head and walk away... with a smile. :)

Therefore it is good.

I don't usually look at this forum because it often just upsets me...but this is amusing. I agree most with what Ozone said about entertainment being a convenient scapegoat and not really having much a correlation. From personal experience, though, I have a friend who has the most horrifically large collection of porn I've ever seen (or, uhm, not seen, as the case may be) and in real life is the most nonsexual male you'll encounter. Go figure...

funny story about kids and access to porn - when i was a kid i used to walk for hours searching my neighborhood for discarded porn, that was my hobby, but now kids have the internet , that's prolly why kids are getting so fat !

I gotta say that I think saying porn increases rape and stuff is the same as saying video games increase violence. It's absolute B.S.! There have been plenty of rapist and psycopaths out there that have had problems way before their "incident". The fact of the matter is that after they're caught, background checks usually turn up that they play games or like porn and somehow someway that seems to be the answer. It's another way for censors to add another bullet in their guns imo.

yea , like - what if they found out that some mass murderer was a huge American Idol fan ? would that be relevant ?

its like -- " this serial rapist had porn on his computer " *gasp* SHOCKING !!!
oh but wait , prolly everybody has porn on their computer ! unless you're just not interested in sex, and in that case , you're prolly a Reptile !!!

o_0

Yeah... Why rape someone when you can watch porn?

It is not good for society. Consider that this is someone's daughter, or son.

Thats just like saying people killed people because of video games. Porn has nothing to do with any of the motives of serial killers. One day Ted Bundy didn't watch a Sadomasocistic porn and decide "that sounds like fun, i'm going to kill and eat people!".

joeychips
It is not good for society. Consider that this is someone's daughter, or son.

Yeah? Well consider the fact that the person you may or may not have a relationship with is also someones child.

thehothead

joeychips
It is not good for society. Consider that this is someone's daughter, or son.

Yeah? Well consider the fact that the person you may or may not have a relationship with is also someones child.

lol, right on. Besides...parents doesn't always have to like what their children end up doing when they become adults. in fact half of the time they don't even like what thier children end up doing even if it was an "decent job" to start with.

They also may not even like the husband and or boyfriend that thier "little girl" choose.
So JoeyChip's girlfriend and or wife might end up having parents who thinks that their "little girl" is too good for the likes of JoeyChips to have. That JoeyChips should never be allowed to boink thier "little girl" if they had an say in it... even though thier "little girl" is like 20 or over and is perfectly old enough to have her own say on what kind of man she wants.

Face it-- in an parent's perfect world, thier children would NEVER have sex much less an relationship even when they were adults. They'd preffer to think of thier children as "innocent" forever...they just don't want to think of thier children having an love life, an sex life just like them.

Face it, as soon as an person grows up, that person is old enough to make consental deicsions on what he/she wants to do. Become an porn star or just watch porn.... or just go out there and enage into sex with their bf/girlfriends.

that sex drive is what drives the speicies on.. so it's all perfectly natural.

So that whole "don't find that so hot, please!! that person is somebody's daughter or son" is not an vaild excuse... unless the said person was underage and way too young to understand consental relationships fully. Then you may have an point there.

Thats just like the person you met in a bar for a one night stand, thats someone daughter, or wife is some cases.
So no matter what you do you can use that excuse? "I would scream that this person for hitting me with their car, but shes someones daughter"

"I would punch this bastard for hitting on my girlfriend, but hes someones son.."

Sorry doesn't work.

Aurora Moon
Face it-- in an parent's perfect world, thier children would NEVER have sex much less an relationship even when they were adults. They'd preffer to think of thier children as "innocent" forever...they just don't want to think of thier children having an love life, an sex life just like them.

Wait til your parents start pressuring you to give them grandchildren.

Hawk

Aurora Moon
Face it-- in an parent's perfect world, thier children would NEVER have sex much less an relationship even when they were adults. They'd preffer to think of thier children as "innocent" forever...they just don't want to think of thier children having an love life, an sex life just like them.

Wait til your parents start pressuring you to give them grandchildren.

I'd be like... "FUCK YOU MOM AND DAD!"

errr...

But maybe I will tell them in a polite way. And explain to them in a nice way that it is completely illogical to bring children into this world. Seriously.... I dont see a single percent of logic as to why bring children in this world. If I come to a point where I can justify beating up a random person and dunking his head in the toilet. Or simply "making people's lives miserable for the hell of it". I would. I would bring children in the world!!!



With the current climate... economic instability... Loss of job is just on the horizon. Like... sure sure. I become a rich suburban dude with a 5 bedroom house. Once my job gets transferred somewhere else... or I become "redundant"... or if I refuse to oppress and screw up others for the sake of growing wealth... or if I refuse to be part of this sexist system that favors women and vulture divorce courts that see me as nothing but a cash cow.

Therefore it is completely logical. To live FREE.

And uuh... when you grow old nobodys gonna take care of you!!! WAAAAHHH!!!!

Bullshit! There is always a chance for my son growin up to be a gangsta and my daughter growin up to be a whore. And my wife taking advantage of the oppressive divorce court system and milking me off my hard earned money!

Its not a difficult choice. Even if you have a below average IQ, you will arrive at the same conclusion. (that is... if you use your head between the SHOULDERS and not the head between the LEGS)

errr...

offtopic. lol


Anyway back to the topic, so yeah. porn is good for me to satisfy my base instincts without risking getting into trouble with the law or fake sex harrassment charges.

There. Fine. Laugh at me. I'm soooo paranoid and I just need to go to a... mwentwal instwitwution and eat my pswiachiatwic medwicine...

Hawk

Aurora Moon
Face it-- in an parent's perfect world, thier children would NEVER have sex much less an relationship even when they were adults. They'd preffer to think of thier children as "innocent" forever...they just don't want to think of thier children having an love life, an sex life just like them.

Wait til your parents start pressuring you to give them grandchildren.

And what if your parents already have grandchildren from thier oldest children?
As being the youngest, my parents tend to be overprotective of me, and doesn't even think of wanting grand-children from me because I'm their "little girl", who they want to see as perfectly innocent in every way.

I think someone people really do need some porn to help them along during the day. I am shocked that porn may have actually decreased rape, but it does sense when you get right down to it.

All I was trying to say earlier is that people are precious, and those who participate in the making of such offensive content often have a change of heart when they have children of their own. Not many age to say with pride, "Look what I did when I was younger." Rather, they are filled with shame. The models/actors/actresses that are involved in this industry often are slaves (literally or by coersion) or are looking for a way to get out of the industry. But for whatever reason, they are stuck. If you know your international news, you'll recall that there is a terrible amount of abuse in this field... enough to bring a person to tears.

joeychips
All I was trying to say earlier is that people are precious, and those who participate in the making of such offensive content often have a change of heart when they have children of their own. Not many age to say with pride, "Look what I did when I was younger." Rather, they are filled with shame. The models/actors/actresses that are involved in this industry often are slaves (literally or by coersion) or are looking for a way to get out of the industry. But for whatever reason, they are stuck. If you know your international news, you'll recall that there is a terrible amount of abuse in this field... enough to bring a person to tears.

That's not the case in the american porn business. the majority of the porn stars are often treated with respect, and thier safety are always first before the money. Why else do they have such regular monthly testing for sexual dieases, etc if those women/men were treated in such a way like you claim?
If they were treated like dirt, then I doubt that the people in the porn bussiness behind the camera would care about the porn stars' health. and not to meition it's the law too as well... the people in the bussiness cannot do it out of coersion. If it was ever found out that an business did things by slavery and coersion, that business would be shut down so fast that they wouldn't even know what hit them.

the only way that what you said was true was if you were looking at porn made by forigen countries where they don't have those laws in place.

And just so you know, I happen to have an friend who works in the porn bussiness, and this is how I know this for an fact. She has children and she isn't really that ashamed about what she does. Of course she's not a porn star but rather a director that directs porn. But that still counts in a way....
And you know what she tells her children? That she's an director of mature films, and she leaves it at that. If they start to ask questions then she'll tell them straightfoward in the least graphic way possible.

Yeah, to you and your "mighty morals" that might not seem right at all... But morality is relative. To her, she's being an good parent by being honest with her children... and also instilling the morals that she has, which is:
"Never do anything that would hurt people. Don't do things against thier will nethier, that's just wrong." in fact most of her morals are usually pretty simlar to the "everyday" morals that all parents try to instill into their children.

in the end, it's just an job like everything else.