This is kind of a rant, but it has been festering for quite awhile now. The more and more I go on different webcomic forums, the more I find myself becoming annoyed with whiny webcomic creators. People posing questions like "How do I stay motivated at the beginning" as in they have literally 7 pages up, but are finding it hard to stay motivated.

What? You know what, stop making comics. Just stop making them, because you don't love making comics. You're just one of the many new young webcomic creators who think just because you've made a webcomic, you're entitled fame an adoration the next day. You know why I make comics? Because I love it. I've completed 200 page comics before the internet even existed. You know who read them? 3 or 4 of my friends tops. I didn't make comics for them, I made them because I loved to draw and I fell in love with the art form at 12 years old.

I love telling stories. I'm happy that my comics have connected with so many readers. But I wasn't expecting fame and fortune when I started posting. If you're struggling to keep motivated at 7 pages in, how is that possible? I'm not trying to come across as a jerk, (Okay, actually I am) that is the be all end all of comics. I'm not. And I don't wanna question anyone's desire to create comics.

But, maybe you should try creating a few complete stories before you post anything to the web. See if you can manage, see if you can create a story just because you WANT to. Not because it's gonna make you famous. Okay my rant is over. Feel free to add your own thoughts. This has just been rising to a boil, and I had to vent.

Damn straight. I wish I could say more, but what I'd want to say was already said in your first post.

I think people start out and realise that keeping it going is a lot more work then they realised. Just look on the DD listings and about half the comics are ones that were abandoned with less then 5 pages.

harkovast
I think people start out and realise that keeping it going is a lot more work then they realised. Just look on the DD listings and about half the comics are ones that were abandoned with less then 5 pages.

It's not even that that bugs me so much. It's just people think "Hey I"ll start a webcomic" they post 5 pages, and then start posting in every webcomic forum on the internet "Why isn't anyone reading my comic?"

Maybe because you only have 5 pages up, and there are about 10,000 other comics you're competing with!

Just make your comic and don't start whining about how it's a struggle to make your comic when you don't have any readers. You aren't struggling because you don't have readers, it's because you really don't have a desire to do a webcomic for the right reasons.

I think they want the magic comic creator fairy to swoop in and save them and draw everything for them :3

I mean, I posted this question when I was 4 pages into my webcomic and all of a sudden J Scott Campbell replied back and has been making my comic for me ever since. That really motivated me when he started doing that! ^^

I want the magic comic fairy to make people read my comic more...possibly at gun point.

What I relate to about your rant is "before the internet." I made and photocopied comics when I was a kid. I convinced the local comic shop at the time to sell them (at no profit to me) for less than the actual cost of making them. I loved having an avenue to share them. I am so appreciative of the Duck and that I can post to an audience that is possibly endless and earned by my own merit. It's amazing. Imagine no webcomics at all and having your creation hang out (best) in a local comic shop or (worst) inside your sketch pads on shelves.

I think even us older timers take a bit for granted. Remember when if you said webcomic, people would've responded: Spiderman? And you were lucky if you could find those people?

Agreed. I made comics on paper long before making comics on computers was available.
And there was no internet that I knew about back then. And in 99 when I finally got dial up putting comics on the web wasn't on my mind at all. I just made them for myself.

My family didn't read them. My friends didn't read them. Only I read them. And it's the same now. Except now I can make them on a computer and upload them to the internet and finally get feedback at ALL. Or not... I didn't care at the time back when I started.

When I saw that DD counter say I had 70 views on that 1st day of uploading I remember being so happy that that many had looked at my work. That was 70 times more than had looked at it beforehand ^^

And people say that the internet makes it so we don't get out and socialize! Heck, without the net I would still be in the house all the time jumping on Goombas, throwing hadokens, and drawing comics. At least now I am reminded there are real people in the world. =p

Making a comic (for web or note) takes a lot of devotion and time. Some people get all hyped up and after 2 pages it becomes a chore. They need instant gratification. Though when you 1st start the comics it is usually tough because most of the stories you want to make are a tad later on.

JustNoPoint
Making a comic (for web or note) takes a lot of devotion and time. Some people get all hyped up and after 2 pages it becomes a chore. They need instant gratification. Though when you 1st start the comics it is usually tough because most of the stories you want to make are a tad later on.

It's pretty much this, now i'm assuming the ones posting 7 pages and then leaving have decent art(or something that takes them more then 6 hours a page and not in ms paint) and have plotted their story to a degree(or know about how long this thing is instead of making it up as they go)

Webcomics do take a lot of work for small payback, in fact the readership is often the sole payback. Seriously screw the people trying to act superior because they 'make webcomics for themselves'. If that was really true, you would never have posted the thing on the web or check it periodically for comments and views. Love and wanting to improve are great motivators, but acknowledgment for the achievement is worth so much more.

I can understand how it feels to look at 5000+ webcomics with more readers than your own and wondering if putting so much work into the comics is never going to go anywhere. Even though i loved the story it was a scary feeling to think 'i could get to page 50 before i realize this is not going anywhere good and my time could have been spent on other projects, on another story!'. And that does happen to people. There's no one there to tell them and frankly if there was, 90% of them wouldn't listen if there was.

So fans are one of the best motivators and paybacks of a comic, love is not the only one and it's unfair to say they don't love comics like you just because they can't strive on 3-4 fans for 200 pages.

Skullbie
Seriously screw the people trying to act superior because they 'make webcomics for themselves'. If that was really true, you would never have posted the thing on the web or check it periodically for comments and views. Love and wanting to improve are great motivators, but acknowledgment for the achievement is worth so much more.

Seriously, I don't think anyone has said this in this thread. The overall agreement has been that it's nice to have the opportunity even if you don't get a huge fanbase all at once or profit/fame ever. We make comics because we are going to anyway. We post them because it's a great opportunity to share and connect.

She's right though. Comments and acknowledgment really go a long way with motivation. Had I actually posted all 300 pages and never had a commenter I wonder if I would keep posting them or if I would have just stopped wasting the upload time and kept making them just for myself.

After a while you would feel like you were talking to thin air after all =p
Depending on your threshold that could be 4-5 pages for some people.

But then you get these AMAZING artists that upload 4-5 pages and get all kinds of comments right off the bat. Then POOF they disappear too >:-(

Most are real life issues. I guess they normally just draw random things and actual comic making is too tasking.

JustNoPoint
She's right though. Comments and acknowledgment really go a long way with motivation. Had I actually posted all 300 pages and never had a commenter I wonder if I would keep posting them or if I would have just stopped wasting the upload time and kept making them just for myself.

After a while you would feel like you were talking to thin air after all =p
Depending on your threshold that could be 4-5 pages for some people.

But then you get these AMAZING artists that upload 4-5 pages and get all kinds of comments right off the bat. Then POOF they disappear too >:-(

Most are real life issues. I guess they normally just draw random things and actual comic making is too tasking.

I agree, she is right about that and so are you. I just don't think anyone stated they are making webcomics only for themselves. That would be an oxymoron.

It would be like saying this is a private public service announcement.

Ah, I misinterpreted. My apologies =)

'Making comics for myself' is the air i got from zaymac even though he never used the wording, because there was a thread a ways back along this vein(not by him but fans vs love and stuff) where quite a few posters said that exact phrase and had arguments echoing zaymac's.

I should have clarified, my bad

Skullbie
'Making comics for myself' is the air i got from zaymac even though he never used the wording, because there was a thread a ways back along this vein(not by him but fans vs love and stuff) where quite a few posters said that exact phrase and had arguments echoing zaymac's.

I should have clarified, my bad

Well obviously everyone wants other people to enjoy their story and comics, but ultimately I always make comics for myself first and foremost. By that I mean, I make comics that I would want to read. I like to create stories, and obviously the internet helps get my stories out there, so why not use it.

I guess my main point is, nowadays everyone just reads "How to make webcomics" and they decide to plow headfirst into marketing and gaining readership right off the bat. And then they get discouraged when it doesn't happen for them. People get to focused and caught up in the business and marketing aspects of webcomics to soon in my opinion. When they should just focus making a GOOD webcomic first, and all of that other stuff will fall into place down the road.

And I have more than 3-4 fans. It's more like 6-10. :)

Then those are a few points i would agree too :) And i'm glad you brought up that book, because there's one comment on the site it came from which i think sums up the mentality of that book:

webcomics.com
There's a lot of options that readers can do to support us as authors, and most of them are (unfortunately) free.

I had skimmed through that book in barnes and nobles, i didn't go in depth but there was something about it that bugged me, and i couldn't pinpoint it. And then with that comment i kind of realized the motto seemed to be to create a formula comic that has marketing possibilities(i.e. just like the authors) and many times it seemed to come up that readers are something to profit off of--which is sort of true, just i can see how people would get a selfish mentality from reading this book.

I think it's good they created a book since 2 of the 4 authors live off their comic, but their way is not the only way to go with it, which a lot of points in the book seemed to imply.

...got a bit off topic there, but yeah tl;dr: i can see where they got that mentality if they read that book.

I completely agree with what your saying, with my old comic series I did over a hundred issues and I'm the only person who saw them (except for a few close friends)

Look at the webcomics that dont give up. model yourself after them.


but then again, you can take what i say with a grain of salt, since i ended my webcomic.

I don't know about anybody else, but I know I created mine for the love of doin' it, as well as for anybody else who wants to look at it. For the fans of my band (the few who are also into comics, anyway) and just for something to occupy my time.
Now I keep after it because I enjoy it, and really, the pageviews make it all the sweeter. The comics I did in highschool got, like LITERALLY 3 people, and THOSE were the other guys workin on em with me.
I guess what I'm sayin' is that makin' a comic's more or less a labor of love. Those who get nothing out of it are generally the same ones that stop doin' it. I think that, since there are so few people that actually are able to make a living off their work, it should pretty much never be about the money. Now, fame, maybe...but really? How many authors get really all that famous with this? If ya don't love it, why do it?

...wow...I forgot where I was goin' with that, but I may have just inspired myself to go draw...later!

Personally I think Zaymac is overrreacting.

The same thing happens to artists and writers all over the world. It's called Artist/Writers block and even the best at their craft get it at some point during their careers.

These people are asking for assistance with getting over it. Tips and tricks to keep themselves going. And simply saying "YOU MUST NOT LIKE DOING IT ENUFF U FAG JUST QUIT LOL!!!" isn't going to help. Some of these people could have interesting ideas but have difficulty implementing them. That's all. You shouldn't be discouraging them because of your own impatience.

Faliat
Personally I think Zaymac is overrreacting.

The same thing happens to artists and writers all over the world. It's called Artist/Writers block and even the best at their craft get it at some point during their careers.

These people are asking for assistance with getting over it. Tips and tricks to keep themselves going. And simply saying "YOU MUST NOT LIKE DOING IT ENUFF U FAG JUST QUIT LOL!!!" isn't going to help. Some of these people could have interesting ideas but have difficulty implementing them. That's all. You shouldn't be discouraging them because of your own impatience.

Writers block at 7 pages in? Maybe they should plan out their EPIC story past 7 pages before posting it, if writers block is that much of an issue.

Personally, I'm not impatient waiting for their stories. I'm just tired of seeing the same whiny posts over and over on every webcomic forum I visit.

And for future reference I don't speak in all caps like an angry spriter.

What webcomic forums are you speaking of?

zaymac

Faliat
Personally I think Zaymac is overrreacting.

The same thing happens to artists and writers all over the world. It's called Artist/Writers block and even the best at their craft get it at some point during their careers.

These people are asking for assistance with getting over it. Tips and tricks to keep themselves going. And simply saying "YOU MUST NOT LIKE DOING IT ENUFF U FAG JUST QUIT LOL!!!" isn't going to help. Some of these people could have interesting ideas but have difficulty implementing them. That's all. You shouldn't be discouraging them because of your own impatience.

Writers block at 7 pages in? Maybe they should plan out their EPIC story past 7 pages before posting it, if writers block is that much of an issue.

Personally, I'm not impatient waiting for their stories. I'm just tired of seeing the same whiny posts over and over on every webcomic forum I visit.

And for future reference I don't speak in all caps like an angry spriter.

Well, maybe they haven't been properly trained at their craft yet? Maybe they weren't told how to plan ahead and it's why they're asking for help? Maybe they need to be told constructively instead of "I'm sick of you not planning! Plan stuff! Don't know how to plan? YOU SUCK! GTFO!"

I'm sick of seeing people making the assumption that people asking for help is "whiny". But me saying I don't like it isn't going to help anybody unless I explain why I find it so annoyingly ignorant.

And have you ever heard fo a little thing called OVEREXAGGERATION?!?!?!?!?!

I don't know if it's necessarily the readers. I think that a big problem is that most people go into this without knowing how much effort it takes to actually draw a webcomic. I'm with all of you, I used to draw comics as a kid, but back then I only inked and colored the pages that I actually liked, not every single one I drew, so that was all for pure fun. Even though, zaymac, you claim that webcomic artists are annoying because they think too much about readers, I feel like that does put a damper on your comic if you arent prepared for the workload that's coming. Afterall, unlike the sketches in your notepad, webcomics ARE being presented to readers (even if you're only getting 10 a day it's still being looked at) so you need to make your work presentable, and that take more work than someone who has never done that before expects. So I think a big reason a lot of artists disappear after a few pages must be because they just realize they couldn't do it. It's hard to have a hobby that takes up this much time and gets hardly any rewards. I guess that some people think that if they aren't going to get any money/fans out of it, then they should just continue to draw for themselves. It doesn't mean they don't love drawing comics, it just probably means they weren't suited for this style of comics...

Maybe it's like Faliat says and they just need encouragement? :)

It does actually annoy me a little too when someone bombs the forums with a thread in general or even comic discussion asking "Why aren't people reading my comic???!!" and they've only got a few pages or it's a really crappy comic or something. And those people that drama-rage about having to quit after 5 pages... -_-

This is highlighted for me especially when I'm looking for features and I see some amazing quality work that's been going for 2 years regularly non stop and it only has a handful of readers. I am in awe of those guys that do their work with almost no recognition and keep going anyway. They're webcomic heroes!
Then there are these beautiful amazing pieces of work that had a huge build-up, with character profiles and draft artwork all posted first... and then you find they stopped completely after 5 pages in 2007 because the author just found they couldn't do the thing any longer. That is SUCH a big disappointment. T_T

----
OK, there is all that aspect to this, BUT, I'm still reminded a little bit of the dicks who want the beginners to stop because they feel they own the medium now. This comic says it beautifully:
Warning NSFW http://www.drunkduck.com/Blonde_Marvel/index.php?p=624893

I get quite irritated with the topics that say "Why aren't people reading my comic?" and the comic is only five pages long. Thing is, I don't care if the art is Botticelli-lite or copy-paste ripoff sprites, nobody will read a comic without, and this is the key word, promotion. Comics don't just magically sprout readers out of the blue.

ozoneocean
OK, there is all that aspect to this, BUT, I'm still reminded a little bit of the dicks who want the beginners to stop because they feel they own the medium now. This comic says it beautifully:
Warning NSFW http://www.drunkduck.com/Blonde_Marvel/index.php?p=624893

I think i just shed a single tear of liberty, that was beautiful ;-;

I think what we've learned from this thread, is that I hate newbies. :)

Just kidding. I have nothing against people who want to start a webcomic. But what are your motivations behind starting a webcomic?

If you wanna make money from your comic, that's great. I think all of us would like to. Do you want tons of readers? I can also relate.

But what annoys me, is I think some folks expect this to happen after 5 or 7 pages. I'm sorry, but that is just being naïve.

So, what I was trying to get across in my original post, is that you should be doing this for more than fame and fortune, cuz chances are you"ll end up getting discouraged.

And instead of making your first webcomic a 500 page epic. Why not try a 10 to 30 page story to test the waters and learn from experience.

But those are just my thoughts on the matter. I'm sure people are gonna continue to do what they want, rather than listen to a crazy old man. :)

Don't trust any webcomic creators over 30!

I usually tell people who are interested in creating webcomics not to bother, and I tell people interested in writing stories to try webcomics.

I feel like there's a big difference between those two people. The former group really just wants attention, while the later is looking to create something and isn't scared off by work or lack of recognition.

That actually happened to me last year. Except it wasn't 7 pages, it was 3! I stopped not because of lack of readers (I knew when I started that I wouldn't be showered with praise or fame) but like it keeps getting said, I hadn't done a full-fledged comic before, just doodles.

Thankfully, I had some push to get me to get it up again and keep at it. And my motivation lies in my readers.