Yeah people crack me up when they talk about the culture of death and how human life has less value these days.

Um... 9-11, 7-7, Iraq, Afghanistan, vaccinations, fluoridation of water, MSGs, Aspartame, false-flag terror, abortion, contraception, prozac, depleted uranium, etc. etc. etc.

Yes those things I mentioned are debatable. You can believe the official government story or just say that the water and vaccine and food contaminants are accidental. You can argue that you're for abortion and contraception because of the freedom of choice. You can argue that vaccines and fluoride is good for you.

But this is the undeniable proof:



How will you make 6 billion into 500,000,000 without murdering them? Why will you murder a large majority of the population?

Why does the global 2000 report call the rest of the population "useless eaters"

"Military men are just dumb stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy" - Henry Kissinger -

I love it when you say "undeniable proof" and then put up a picture that might be, um, anything. I do not think that "undeniable" means what you think it means.

I admit, it confuses me when you say that "fluoridated water" is proof that we now live in a culture of death that is much worse than things "used to be." I wonder how you compare Aspartame and fluoridation with the slaughters of earlier times, like say the battle of Maraat in the Crusades, where Christians happily ate Muslims and as Radulph of Caen reported:

"In Ma'arra our troops boiled pagan adults in cooking-pots; they impaled children on spits and devoured them grilled."

A list of the bloodthirsty atrocities of ancient times would go on and on for pages and books, there's not enough ink to record all the blood shed, all the sadism and cruelty. How many people have been crucified, in all of history, and left to die slowly? A million? Five million? How many women have been burned alive at the stake? Ten million? How many babies exposed for wolves to eat? How many innocents tortured to death? How many people enslaved in horrible bondage and crushing toil and hopeless poverty?

In 1014 in the battle of Belasica 50,000 Macedonian soldiers were killed, and the 15,000 survivors were all blinded. The Byzantines let every 100th soldier keep 1 left eye so that they could each lead 100 men back home. What a parade that must have made. Just an example of "the good old days" when there was apparently a "culture of life."

And oddest of all, you hate vaccines, but do not seem to recall the terrible cycles of plagues and disease that people used to die from in endless horrible waves. The Black Death may have killed 1/5 of the world's population in just a generation. And that compares to Aspartame how?

You hate contraceptives and abortion but do not mention the number of women who have died in childbirth throughout history. How many, do you suppose? 100 Million? A Billion? Is that what you want to return to?

I often wonder if you mean these posts, or if you are just pulling our legs. I hope you see them as a sort of performance art, or something like that.

You mention 911, which is quickly approaching Hitler as something which when invoked is meant to ignite passions end rational debate.

But lets take both 911 and the holocaust as examples. I'm sure there are no rational people here who deny the horror of those two events, but that is precisely why I feel that we are more civilized and respect life more now.

The fact that we hate these events is an indication of what an abberration, what a throwback they are. These are two heinous, barbarous events which call back to an earlier time when the taking of mass lives was done without a scintilla of regret.

These days genocide and mass murder are the exception, they are actions to be reviled in the international community, not accepted blithely as the status quo.

I don't think Kyupol does that because he wants to debate about it. It's just his standard rant: when something provokes him to it, he lets go with a variation of the "humanity is being controlled and killed by some shadowy power" conspiracy.

I'm not saying that to attack him, but to help people understand him better. Those views aren't really up for debate, they're part of his "core" views. That's just him :)


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Still, both you two make interesting points in rebuttal. I like that about the holocaust etc Bob, and the things Stacy mentions about atrocities in ancient times is pretty important.

Kind of reminds me when they cut off a monkey's head and put it on another monkey's body to see if the monkey would live. It lived for quite some time, but died due to the body rejecting it.

DARKNES
Why are we greater than the animals just cause we are smarter!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Actually, it's the opposable thumbs. We fucking RULE!

Lots of animals have opposable thumbs or thumb-like digits that do the holding.

We don't really know what makes humans the dominant animal that we are. We walk around on two legs, hold things etc... But that didn't make us what we are since other creatures do the same. If we slithered around like slugs we'd probably claim it was our amazing pseudopods that were responsible for our brilliance! lol!

We have our big brains, but then again, might we have evolved those to cope with our early developing cultural ways back when we were first just an elaborately social pack animal?

Its probably a mix of things... But judging by the way Children left to be raised by dogs and such take on dog characteristics (or whatever animal that raises them), it's our learning and culture that defines us. Without that it appears we revert to nothing more than simple beasts.
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Doe that make it ethical for us to do what we like with other animals? No, it's doesn't justify it one way or the other. There is no universal rationalisation for that, it depends on the social-cultural framework at the time in the place where the people are proposing to do these things.

yes, they do Ozone, and that's why monkeys rule, too!

koalas have two on each hand, plus they're Australian, so they rule all. ;)
I like frog hands the best, they're so cute ^_^

DARKNES
Look you talk about the poor humans but does anyone talk about the poor fucking animals? As a vegetarian I believe that animals have the same rights as humans. How can people sleep at night when these poor animals are being tested on?

Right I cleaned that post up a bit for you. You're welcome.

Anyways most people sleep that way at night because it's easier to ignore problems that don't relate to you than to spend extra time that they don't have to try and stop it. Yeah animal testing sucks. But I'm not going to stop eating meat or break into zoos to try and save them. I can respect your right to eat vegetables and your desire to help animals. But that also means you have to respect MY right to eat animals and ignore their plight.


As for the topic at hand, I'm more than a little surprised that there aren't alot of posts by furries talking about finally becoming their real selves or whatever. And that's what scares me about hybrid creatures. Especially considering one hypothetical: that it can only be done to a fetus. Imagine a fury couple saves up enough money to have their child altered with wolf DNA, or something like that. Who says that the kid WANTS to be half wolf? Who says that he should have to be subjected to all the angry people who don't agree with the idea of hybrid humans?

Of course the topic isn't about furries, so I'll take it in another direction. Do humans NEED to become hybrid beings? I personally think that despite all of our flaws, we're pretty awesome as a species. With few natural defenses we've managed to take over the planet. I personally think that we have a formula that does not need any tampering with.

And the other side of that same issue, do animals need human DNA? What use do you have for an intelligent dog? What are you going to do if a cow starts demanding equal rights? I say that the only genetic engineering we do on animals is just to make them stronger (physically, and a better immune system), and more nutritious.

However I would have to rethink that stance if asked about making Elephants or Dolphins, both naturally intelligent animals, smart enough to communicate with humans.

Since my work computer bans me from the second page of this thread (someone said something naughty...) I am writing this a bit blind. Back in the 1960's a writer named Cordwainer Smith wrote a complete series of wonderful and disturbing and yes, tearful sci-fi books based on the Chimera (and that IS what we are talking about--HYBRIDs are when two species actually breed to form offspring--a Chimera is where genes are recombined to forn a third seperate and genetically viable (hopefully) specied based on recombined DNA) and the issues this would cause. Ie, slavery of chimeras as 'subspecies' or less than human... Sad but thought provoking stuff. The short Story "The Ballad of C'Mell ("C" standing for CAT chimera) about a catwoman sexslave was really sad and tear jerking stuff...