can someone please tell me what the hell the "fourth wall" is?



i've seen people talk about it in comments.

You might get a better range of reponses in the comics discussion forum, but the best I can explain it is:

The fourth wall is a "wall" that exists between the characters in a comic and the reader. So when you hear the expression that one has "broken the fourth wall," it means that the character acknowledges that they are being watched by an audience (by addressing the reader directly) or that they realize they're in a comic (by walking out of the frames or talking about being in a comic).

I'm sure someone has a better definition somewhere ^.^

OOOOHHHHHHHHH! i get it now!!!

Th expression comes from the theatre, where a typical stage set would have three walls (one at the back and one at each side). The "fourth wall" (the one that would be between the actors and the audience) obviously doesn't exist, but the actors/characters behave as if it does. The world of the play is supposedly real for the actors on-stage who therefore behave as if they are unaware of the audience's existence.

"Breaking the fourth wall" is when actors/characters address the audience directly (as opposed to other characters within the story). By doing that, they aknowledge that that they know they are are only characters in a play/comic/movie and that the events they are involved in are fictitious.

Its when the character talks to the readers or acknowledges that they're just cartoon characters.

Examples:

- In an old Combatron comics I've read, the bad guy says "We've been fighting for more than 10 issues of this comic and you haven't kicked my ass yet! What's the matter?"

- And I sometimes break the 4th wall
http://www.drunkduck.com/MAG_ISA/index.php?p=416645
http://www.drunkduck.com/MAG_ISA/index.php?p=297774

kyupol
Its when the character talks to the readers or acknowledges that they're just cartoon characters.

Examples:

- In an old Combatron comics I've read, the bad guy says "We've been fighting for more than 10 issues of this comic and you haven't kicked my ass yet! What's the matter?"

- And I sometimes break the 4th wall
http://www.drunkduck.com/MAG_ISA/index.php?p=416645
http://www.drunkduck.com/MAG_ISA/index.php?p=297774

Breaking the fourth wall is specifically acknowledging the audience or reader.

What you described is metafiction or the knowledge of fictitious elements within the world itself.

amanda
You might get a better range of reponses in the comics discussion forum, but the best I can explain it is:

The fourth wall is a "wall" that exists between the characters in a comic and the reader. So when you hear the expression that one has "broken the fourth wall," it means that the character acknowledges that they are being watched by an audience (by addressing the reader directly) or that they realize they're in a comic (by walking out of the frames or talking about being in a comic).

I'm sure someone has a better definition somewhere ^.^

that's it, right there! along with the other 5 times people repeated it.

Its easy to express through example.

Imagine a comic with two cats in it.

one says "Wow, this sure is a crappy comic, harkovast hasn;t even bothered to draw us!"

The second responds "Yeah, we only exist as an example on a forum! How crappy is that!"

The first responds "Well at least we managed to break the forth wall before the example finished and we ceased to exist!"

And that's what breaking the forth wall is all about!

Angry_black_guy is the only person who has explained this correctly.
Breaking the 4th wall means that the charecter has acknowledged the audience but never made specific reference to being fictional. Malcom in the middle did this a lot when Malcom would have dialouge looking into the camera that no one else could hear.
I kind of did this in one comic, but it could be seen as the guy talking to himself. http://www.drunkduck.com/BffSatan/index.php?p=539125
Meta-humour is if the charecter specificaly states that their world is fictional, the situation Harkovast described would be meta-humour.

If you want a good example of how to break the 4th wall, read Deadpool comics. Happens all the time. It's mainly used as a comedy device, but I have seen it used in serious situations once or twice.

Really though, mostly everyone else has covered it. Just remember that I'm pretty sure it only counts if a character acknowledges the reader, not a narrator. Though I don't think there is a rule about this or anything, just how I've personally come to understand it.

Does it count as breaking the fourth wall if a character does not believe that the world they inhabit is real and adresses an unseen audience that they believe exists, but doesn't in the reality of the comic (even though there is an audience reading the comic in reality)?

Good question, but I dont think so. I think the character has to KNOW he is addressing the audience. Like...for a fact. But I could be wrong.

Phillby
Does it count as breaking the fourth wall if a character does not believe that the world they inhabit is real and adresses an unseen audience that they believe exists, but doesn't in the reality of the comic (even though there is an audience reading the comic in reality)?

No, because no one in the fictional world is interacting with the audience in real real world.

This is similar to the situation faced by Will Ferrell's character in Stranger than Fiction. Although he comes to realise he is fictional and addresses his author (Emma Thompson), to the real-world audience (i.e. us!) she is part of the fictional world, too.

The fourth wall is an iritating term for a silly little and often harmlessly amusing thing writers do. It shits me when people go "OH NO YOU BROKE THE FOURTH WALL" or when they themselves go "HO HO I'M BREAKING THE FOURTH WALL! HE HE"... Like it was a punch and Judy show or a pantomime or something.

The term shouldn't even be used. Or we should have terms for every single device writers use in their work and we should all shout out whenever we see each one being used. :)

-"Hey! I'm doing that thing where the hero establishes his primary motivation here!"
-"Oh look! This is where the sexual tension starts! ho hum, that old trick!"
-"He's doing that squinty eyed thing now! That means all the action will start!"

ozoneocean
Or we should have terms for every single device writers use in their work

In almost any medium anything used often enough will acquire a name. That's how any jargon begins. In US sitcoms, for example, there is a "rule" that - every time a new character appears on a show - they have to give their whole life story within the first few minutes. This mini-bio (usually liberally sprinkled with atrocious one-liners) is called "pipe". It is so commonplace it has become an accepted term.

"How was that entrance?"
"Okay, but I think it needs more pipe. Get the writers to add more pipe."

ozoneocean
and we should all shout out whenever we see each one being used.

In this case, I do! I find it almost impossible to watch a US sitcom now without being very, very aware of the "pipe" and groaning: "Oh my God, here we go again!"

DAJB
In this case, I do! I find it almost impossible to watch a US sitcom now without being very, very aware of the "pipe" and groaning: "Oh my God, here we go again!"

I'm never watching TV with you >_<

But if there's a pantomime in town, we'll make it a night! ^__^

I think i've seen this "pipe" thing before, although it applies to much more than sitcoms.





(by the way, i thought that Harkovast's example of meta-fiction was particularly clever ;>)

My favorite writing term is "Jumping the Shark". For those that don't know it comes from the Happy Days Episode where Fonze did just that on his Motorcycle. It means the writer has broken the rules of the world he/she has created.

Warpedwenger
My favorite writing term is "Jumping the Shark". For those that don't know it comes from the Happy Days Episode where Fonze did just that on his Motorcycle. It means the writer has broken the rules of the world he/she has created.

Actually, it means altering the mood and direction of the series in such a way that it leads to its downfall and demise. It sort of "breaks rules" but it's more along the lines of a mood. (In webcomics, it's usually when a gag strip turns into a drawn out drama.)

A related term is "Growing the Beard" in which a series' mood and direction is drastically altered but instead of leading to its demise, the series becomes much better. That term comes from Star Trek TNG referring to General Riker's beard.

Ya I was keeping it more simple. Than that anyway I've never heard growing the beard I like that one too.

Bah, I LITERALLY broke the fourth wall!

^ Haha, nicely done, dcole!

I had forgotten that the phrase "jumping the shark" came from Happy Days, and I've actually never heard of "growing the beard" either... You learn something new everyday!