Once people go past spanking and instead beat and emotionally damage their (or other people's) children, it's no longer spanking. Then it truly becomes abuse and should be prosecuted to the full extent of existing laws.

We don't need new ones yet, in my opinion.

Outlawing spanking would create a much worse problem.

Yeah, what Due-east said. There's actual spankings, and then there's psychical abuse that some creeps try to pass off as "spankings".

the "second type" isn't really spanking at all but all out anger attacks on innocent children... which is why the laws serves to stop that kind of thing.


So Spankings are Okay for Isocline. May not work for some kids because it has no effect on them... that's when other different methods of Discipline, such as taking away their video games and other entertainment works.

The things that are illegal: when you react in full anger at something an child has done; uses something like your belt to literally whip their backs so hard that they actually leave bruises and other nasty marks that would last for weeks. Now, THAT'S ABUSE.

I guess what I'm trying to say here, is that there's a difference between real controlled Discipline and acting out of fury.

spanking doesn't really teach the kid much.

yer just dismissing the problem and answering it with violence.
so the kid grows up thinking violence solves problems.

let him/her get a chance to know the mistake and try to solve the problem and advice them on how to prevent future mistakes.

talk it out. most kids are smart enough to understand.

I'm not against smacking a child. Sometimes talking to them just won't cut it and they need the short sharp shock of a tap on the hand or the rear to snap them out of it and realise what they've done.

My mum always gave us an eye for an eye type disciplne - if one of us smacked someone else she'd smack us, if we pinched someone else she'd pinch us... When we were being good she'd tell us not to be naughty or she'd hit us with a big stick that she kept in a cupboard - we NEVER saw this stick and were NEVER hit with it but the sheer threat of such a thing prevented us from being bad. I also remember a teacher who threatened the class with the cane - that never materialised either because she probably would have gotten the sack but again, the threat of actual physical punishment meant no kid would ever give her shit. After that I haven't turned out unbalanced and violent. Quite the opposite - I'm a really gentle person~ XD

I think the threatening way physical punishment was presented to me caused me to respect my elders. I knew that if I did bad they could hurt me. Yeah, I guess I feared them~ but I also looked up to them, did what they told me to, listened to them and in turn was treated really well. It doesn't take long for a child to learn bad behavior getting you a smack isn't as good as good behavior getting you treats and positive attention. X3

Some parents take it too far and just needlessly abuse their children. Some are very unbalanced with their discipline - if the child does the slighest thing wrong they get chastisised and all their good deeds and achievements are ignored. The trick is to teach them that good behaviour pays off and bad behaviour doesn't. If you need to give them a whack on the rump to teach them that then I see nothing wrong with it.

Sub,

No offense meant but you don't have kids yet, do you?

In theory, what you're saying is logical but it doesn't work in reality.

Kids need consequences for actions and grounding/time out only goes so far.

But even if a parent does spank their child, it is equally important that they show their children they love them, too.

so the kid will connect love with spanking or hurting?

heh

i'm sure that won't mess some kids up as they get older...

Oh, wait, you're talking about spanking CHILDREN. Yeah, probably not the best idea.

No, the kid gets an overall view over time not to do certain misbehaviors. The idea is that nobody wants spankings; even the parents don't like doing it. It's not like it's something that's dished out every day or something. And it's not so much about a temporary smarting, it's that it is a punishment, a consequence that is to be avoided.

what's done is done, but helping your kid to avoid future mistakes doesn't require pain.

kids aren't dogs, they're a sponge of knowledge and if you help them acknowledge thier mistakes and try to find a resolution or problem solving skills to prevent those mistakes then they will grow up smarter.

spanking doesn't neccesarily give kids life learning skills. i mean is someone gonna spank him when he goes to college and make mistakes on his tests?

no.

so i don't see the reason for spanking to help make your child intellegent.
help them with problem solving skills go a longer way than induction of pain.

Lol, I wasn't sure whether this was some kind of S&M thread either XD

I think smacking shouldn't be illegal but similarly it shouldn't be socially acceptable either. Someone using smacking as the only form of discipline against a child is of course not going to raise them well. But if it’s used as part of a gradient, for instance, taking away their games console when they misbehave and only leaving smacking for very serious incidents that put themselves or others in serious danger e.g. running across the road or hitting their friend across the face with a stick.

Hitting with objects, across the head or hitting a child extremely hard is, I believe, already a criminal offence and I don't think there need to be any changes.

i think a spanking like evil said should be used for if your child almost got him or herself killed or a playmate but like i said i was spank for the dangerous stuff and sat in the corner for minor also got computer taken away when i got older

Sub,

I think I understand the confusion. I'm not really talking about inducing pain here. To me, spanking was more an embarrassment than painful. It's meant to be a deterrent to the bad behavior. When I spank my kids, it's not to induce pain and it's not with anger. It's a punishment for something significant.

Most of the time, my kids only need to be redirected or have things explained because they're smart and they're good-hearted kids.

But of course, everyone is bound to have a different perspective on this. I suppose that's what this Debate and Discussion forum is for, after all.

Good discussion!

hmmm i guess its time for this topic to die

born AND died in 2 days hu well let me put my 2 cents in. it will be a sad day indeed when spanking becoms ilegal. im 17 now and looking back i would have NEVER listend to my parents if i had never been spanked. the small stuff that i knew i would never get spanked for i did more often. i would never go over that boundry thugh. yea somtimes people abbuse there children and say they where just spanking them and yes that is wrong and yes they should be thrown in jail imedaitly but generaly it is easy to spot if they are abbusing there kids with spankings (brusings and all that). really it all goes back to what evil said about 4 posts ago. its all about fear and knowing that your parents CAN spank you. that is normaly enugh to keep you in line.

My parents spanked me when I was little, and I'm glad they did, because I turned out great.

Pretty much my thoughts.

I don't think people understand that the reason why a lot of kids are acting up and getting into trouble these days is because they lack respect. Making kids sit in a corner for five minutes doesn't cut it. Sometimes kids need to be scared. It doesn't traumatize them. My older brothers and I were spanked. I'm not cowering in a corner with psychological problems today.

It's conditioning. Do something bad? You get smacked. Do something good? You get rewarded/complemented. Passive parents think they're doing their kids a favor. Those are some same kids who grow up having no repect for authority.

Spanking? Hell, when I did something wrong, my punishment involved a steel-toe boot.

In my country it IS illigal to spank your child/ren.
So, duh, I'm not for breaking the law.

I think that meany people use spanking wrong.
Very small kids just dont understand why their parents hurts them and older kids sometimes just don't care.

My parents always appealed to my dignity either by showing that they've really, really sad about what I've did or by asking me what would happend if I did the same to others.

And well, I've turned out great too!

Spanking is typically a lazy way for a parent to attempt to solve a problem. Parents get frustrated... and they easily convert that frustration into violence towards their child, later justifying it as "necessary to make the point" or some such.

In reality, spanking does little other than inspire fear in the child. I know when i was a child spanking never once made me reconsider my actions... It wasn't until I got caught doing something wrong that spanking even came to mind.

However, having two children of my own even I've occasionally been driven to it. It's something I do absolutely hate doing and usually regret after the fact. Luckily I can say I am able to avoid spanking 95% of the time I would usually have, were it not for a little critical thinking.

It's kind of sad really what we are willing to do to our children, who really just learn really well by example, and look to their parents for guidance and protection.

How sad that fear equates to respect for you. I can thinking of countless individuals I respect that I have no fear of at all.

Volte,

I respect your opinion but I do disagree with you that it is a "lazy way" to solve a problem. I do agree with you that I absolutely hate doing it, it's not something either the parent or the child enjoys.

I do believe, however, that we can agree to disagree about this important topic.

Wasn't there a rule of thumb? Like more than twice on the bottom was abuse? I think abuse is bad...but discipline is good if the child remembers the lesson and the parent knows what they want to teach.

It depends on the severity of the spanking, and the tone of the parent doing the spanking.

When I was growing up, my parents had a broad spoon that didn't hurt, it just made a loud noise for when they spanked us kids. Well, okay, it stung a little bit. That early-in-life spanking taught me, very quickly, that there are consequences for bad behaviors, and to have respect for authority. Not FEAR. I didn't fear my parents, because at any given time I was also told how much they loved me, and their tone while spanking wasn't angry, it was just firm.

I certainly don't want children to be abused, or smacked around, or be the victim of anger. A LITTLE fear is a good thing, it teaches caution and to think about your actions before you go ahead and do them. The kids should feel safe, protected, and loved, and know that the spanking is related directly to what they've done wrong.

You're taking my words out of context.

I said that some kids will never listen to or respect you if you don't use corpreal punishment. Not fear = instant respect. I never said "beat up your kids until they run from you".

o.O isn't that abuse?
true like i said i was spanked as a child then i got groundings when i became a teenyeh but for abusive parents they're life sucking is a childs fault

i was spanked when i was little but i'm fine but some people go passed spanking and hurt a kid bad its called child abuse and it needs to stop even if it means out lawing spankings to prevent child abuse

I think once in a while you need to beat your kids' asses once in a while. Ass-beating should be for things they know are wrong though. If you tell your kid to go to bed or do their homework or whatever, and they say "no," what are you going to do? Raise your voice? That just makes them have a greater sense of accomplishment when you eventually give up. It's not child abuse, it's discipline.

I'm sure there are a lot of parents that don't resort to beating their kids if they don't go to sleep

It's the most effective. What is there to do? You can't force them to do anything. You can't give them a time-out if they don't move, you can't make them do anything if they don't choose too.

There are just too many people afraid to hit their kids nowadays. Now a kid could probably get their parents arrested if they don't have their favorite kind of chef boyaredee in the house.

I don't agree with knowingly beating a child and calling it "discipline." That's not discipline and that's not out of love. Using a small switch or a quick light slap to the tush is not the same as letting loose out of anger. Just my opinion...

seems more like lazy parenthood to me.

when i see or hear that they spank their kids for silly things, it sounds like they are taking the easy way out.

there are various ways you can do to help them understand. doesn't have to result to violence all the time